Talk:figeu

Is this cognate with Italian (deprecated template usage) figlio, from Latin (deprecated template usage) filius? —Μετάknowledge^{discuss/deeds} 19:26, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

More likely filiolus. — Ungoliant ^(Falai) 20:19, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Bloody diminutives. I hedged it with "ultimately". —Μετάknowledge^{discuss/deeds} 20:23, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

I think it’s safe to assume it’s from filiolus because Italian tovagliolo = Ligurian tovageu. Do you agree? — Ungoliant ^(Falai) 20:29, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Well... not necessarily. The way I interpret it, the ge is Ligurian's "L₂" phonological reflex, cognate with Italian's gli, Spanish's ll, Portuguese's lh, etc. The standard Latin diminutive suffix system happens to tend to set up such a situation that L₂ has to occur, but just because it occurs in final positions doesn't mean that that's what did happen. I think the liu in filius wuld have been commonly pronounced as something like [ljʊ] in Latin, and that could lead to /ʎ/ etc without having to go through a diminutive form.

I leave it to you to decide whether I'm a madman on a phonological rant or if there's actually any sober support for this belief. —Μετάknowledge^{discuss/deeds} 20:43, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

The problem with a derivation directly from filius is the accent. Figeu’s accent is in the last syllable, which is explained by the loss of intervocalic /l/ (Italian menola, Ligurian ménoa; isola, îsoa) and subsequent merging of syllables (fagiolo, fageu; canale, canâ). — Ungoliant ^(Falai) 20:59, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

I can't find a hole in that logic, especially given the macron in fīlius. Alright, you win (for now) :) —Μετάknowledge^{discuss/deeds} 21:10, 24 November 2012 (UTC)