Reconstruction talk:Proto-Slavic/kъto

I doubt that instrumental form of kъto was cěmь (evidently it's based on CS), because probably all slavic languages has k as first letter in instrumental. I believe that k became c in CS. By the way, etymology: from Proto-Balto-Slavic *kas + a particle *-to. In addition, accusative of kъto looks queerly. I think it's supposed to be kogo. Could you give me source link? Useigor (talk) 19:48, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

If it wasn't cěmь, then what was it? And kogo is the genitive form, not the accusative. —CodeCat 20:00, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Both accusative and genitive should be kogo. --Anatoli ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 20:04, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Historically, the accusative was the same as the nominative. The distinction between animate and inanimate words didn't exist yet in Proto-Slavic. Even in OCS there are still many exceptions, showing that it was still only a tendency at that time, not an absolute rule. Grammars for OCS also give kogo as the genitive only. —CodeCat 20:14, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

You may be right, I don't know. I have no sources on Proto-Slavic or Old Church Slavonic, only judging by the modern languages. Where do you guys take the inflection tables for Proto-Slavic or Old Church Slavonic from? Are there any online resources? In this this revision of [[къто]] the accusative is "кого", which is more modern. Is this correct or OCS has acquired a new form? The instrumental form "кѣмь" is also attestable but the examples are probably all Russian pre-1918 spellings of "кем (kem)". --Anatoli ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 23:34, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

A velar consonant before a front vowel wasn't possible in Proto-Slavic, and not really in OCS either. There was automatically palatalisation of the consonant, which usually turned k into c (or longer ago, to č). So kě would become čě or cě automatically. There's also another later change where ě after a palatal consonant became a, which turned kě into čě into ča. New ě was formed later, which didn't change to a, so that's how you can have cě that doesn't turn into ca; it's a later "layer" of changes. In Slavic terminology they're called the first and second palatalisation. —CodeCat 23:41, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

CodeCat, cěmь should be kěmь. Insrumental form of kъto in slavic languages: belorussian — kim; russian — kem; serbo-croatian — kȋm, kíme; slovene — kóm; czech — kým; polish — kim; slovak — kim; and CS — цѣмь (cěmь). Could you tell me name of process in which c turns into k?

analogy most likely. There is no regular sound change to reverse the second palatalisation, and this is just an exception. —CodeCat 14:18, 22 January 2014 (UTC)

Old East Slavic

Old East Slavic used both хто (xto) and къто (kŭto). --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 08:14, 15 December 2019 (UTC)