Talk:Agnus Dei

Latin vocative

It seems that the vocative is actually Agnus, the same as Deus, and that Agne is not used, at least in later writings. Eric Schiefelbein (talk) 18:00, 6 February 2018 (UTC)

@Eric Schiefelbein: Google Books does have some results for "Agne Dei", but if there are doubts about the existence of this vocative, WT:RFVN can be used.
BTW: A few sources and cites relating to this matter:

• Allen and Greenough's New Latin Grammar (1903, p. 210, § 340 a.): "A noun in the nominative [...] is sometimes used instead of the vocative". Well, with the omitted part it's more specific, but could be too specific, i.e there could be other nominative-for-vocative uses: "A noun in the nominative in apposition with the subject of the imperative mood is sometimes used instead of the vocative:-- audi tu, populus Albanus [macra ommitted] (Liv. i. 24)".
• The Harmonicon. 1832 (p. 179): "From the earliest ages of Christianity the invocation has been written 'Agnus Dei.' The vocative, Agne, is undoubtedly right, though the poets sometimes use us instead of e, after the Attic manner [...]". That mentions Greek influence. In case of Christian terms, there could also be a younger Greek (Koine) influence. And in case of younger Greek, there could be a Semitic or more specific Hewbrew influence, like Jews using a certain form for addressing God, which influenced Greek, which influenced Latin to get vocative-like forms like Dominus and Agnus.
• a Google Books result: "Agnus Dei, qui tollis peccata mundi. Es ist Ausfluß religiöser Scheu, daß für die Form der Anrede nicht der Vokativ Agne, sondern der Nominativ Agnus gebraucht ist." I.e. the nominative is used instead of the vocative out of religious reasons.

-80.133.98.90 19:25, 6 February 2018 (UTC)